It looks like we are getting a version of the Buick Regal.

http://www.nationalpost.com/news/story.html?id=1052937

This is smaller than the next LaCrosse/Invicta with the capability of a smaller 4 cyl engine

So by the time the new Aura gets to us, now badged as a Buick and another nail in the coffin for Saturn, it will be a 3+ year old design.

Sorry, I can't get excited for a sedan that is slated for 4th quarter 2011 that I already know what it looks like.

If the Aura and G6 are left to languish for 3 years as is and the Malibu stays status quo, then much like the Cruze, GM needs this vehicle now, not 2012.

Good News: U.S. will be getting the Insignia based Buick Regal!

Bad News: Production will not start until October 2011?!

Edited December 10, 200816 yr by cire

So by the time the new Aura gets to us, now badged as a Buick and another nail in the coffin for Saturn, it will be a 3+ year old design.

Sorry, I can't get excited for a sedan that is slated for 4th quarter 2011 that I already know what it looks like.

Even if it is '3+ years' old it will be infinitely better than the all-old cars Buick has now (w/ pushrod V6s, 4spd automatics). Sounds like the Regal will replace the current LaCrosse as the 'smaller' sedan and the '10 LaCrosse will replace the Lucerne as the flagship.

why does it take so long?

why does it take so long?

No idea..financial constraints, probably. Anyone know when is the Insignia-based Regal going into production in China? 2009?

Edited December 10, 200816 yr by moltar

So...

What will this essentially replace?

The Aura? The G6?

And WHY-O-WHY is it positioned against the Camry and Accord? Isn't that Chevrolet's job?

Even if it is '3+ years' old it will be infinitely better than the all-old cars Buick has now (w/ pushrod V6s, 4spd automatics). Sounds like the Regal will replace the current LaCrosse as the 'smaller' sedan and the '10 LaCrosse will replace the Lucerne as the flagship.

But will it be better than the competition?

It'll be another "good enough" Aura/Astra style vehicle, I guess.

So...

What will this essentially replace?

The Aura? The G6?

And WHY-O-WHY is it positioned against the Camry and Accord? Isn't that Chevrolet's job?

One could argue it's positioned against the Malibu, since the BPG dealers are competing against Chevy more than other automakers..

One could argue it's positioned against the Malibu, since the BPG dealers are competing against Chevy more than other automakers..

EXACTLY!

If it has more luxury appointments and style, I'd say it's positioned against the S40 and TSX.

If it has more luxury appointments and style, I'd say it's positioned against the S40 and TSX.

Or Milan and MKZ.

And you can hear the Auto Rag sheets now, Get a updated Grandpa Mobile in the New Buick Regal.

I know there are those that love Buick just like I love my cadillac Escalade, but that name really does bring back Seniors driving non inspiring auto's. I do not see it really getting younger famlies excited.

Does anyone have a photo of what this auto looks like? Guess will go and google it to see what it currently looks like in China.

Pick up the Jan edition of Car & Driver. There is a prominent article in there about the New Insignia coming to NA. They don't even mention the Chinese Regal existing, stating this would be the first spin off, and state that a version is coming in the form of a Pontiac. Either they are clueless at C&D or the auto mags can't even keep up with the fast pace of the changes at GM.

And you can hear the Auto Rag sheets now, Get a updated Grandpa Mobile in the New Buick Regal

Until a few short years ago, Cadillac made luxury barges and Buick made sporty luxury cars. Funny how things change when the totem pole gets rocked. I think the same is true for the "new" Buick. To call it a "senior" car is status quo and out-dated. I see more 55+ drivers in Elements and Xbs now. As you get older, your desire is to stay young. No wonder Buick began to be attractive to older folks back in the day when "they" were the sporty luxury division. Guess Scion and Honda best prepare themselves for the stigma that awaits them.

And WHY-O-WHY is it positioned against the Camry and Accord? Isn't that Chevrolet's job?

Because GM still really does not get it.

I agree on the point that better than the current dated platforms and 4-speed/3800 combo cars isn't good enough. It has to be better than the Japanese sedans. And why is it supposed to compete with the Accord and Camry, the Malibu was supposed to do that.

Sounds like the Regal will be midsized and priced in the low $20s, and all it will do is compete with the Malibu.

I agree on the point that better than the current dated platforms and 4-speed/3800 combo cars isn't good enough. It has to be better than the Japanese sedans. And why is it supposed to compete with the Accord and Camry, the Malibu was supposed to do that.

Sounds like the Regal will be midsized and priced in the low $20s, and all it will do is compete with the Malibu.

Well, it does provide fresh product for Avis..

And you can hear the Auto Rag sheets now, Get a updated Grandpa Mobile in the New Buick Regal.

I know there are those that love Buick just like I love my cadillac Escalade, but that name really does bring back Seniors driving non inspiring auto's. I do not see it really getting younger famlies excited.

Does anyone have a photo of what this auto looks like? Guess will go and google it to see what it currently looks like in China.

Around here a lot of seniors are buying Elantras and Altimas. With many seniors retirement funds imploding, they are seeking 'cheaper' cars. An Altima with leather is cheaper than a Malibu or Allure (or whatever you guys call it down there.) I"ve lost two deals in the past month to the Altima.

Hmmm....

Theory?

2010 LaCrosse is AWESOME... price goes up a little each year. Eventually, its price is starting at $30. Regal arrives for the 2012 MY. Regal is a bit smaller, completely premium, starting at $25,000. It has features only available on the top trim Malibu, and features unique to Buick, maybe like AWD, Xenon headlamps, HUD, etc.

Just a guess at what GM could be thinking.

EDIT: I removed an apostrophe.

Edited December 10, 200816 yr by Paolino

sheer stupidity yet again on the time it's coming here. i feel like a broken record with the ignorant GM line. on the issue of who it competes with, GM still has the time to option this one correctly, with the right trim, right engine lineup, etc. as a buick this should only work if it has the right premium design. though i think the insignia is a very well designed car and i loved it as a middle of the road Saturn, i think the premium division needs something more special to be more...premium.

sheer stupidity yet again on the time it's coming here. i feel like a broken record with the ignorant GM line. on the issue of who it competes with, GM still has the time to option this one correctly, with the right trim, right engine lineup, etc. as a buick this should only work if it has the right premium design. though i think the insignia is a very well designed car and i loved it as a middle of the road Saturn, i think the premium division needs something more special to be more...premium.

Agreed and hence why the Insignia makes a better G6.

Of course, this don't matter. The only Buick I would be remotely interested in would be the Commodore-based Park Avenue China got.

Well, it does provide fresh product for Avis..

The whoring of Buick to fleets ended a few years ago.

So...

And WHY-O-WHY is it positioned against the Camry and Accord? Isn't that Chevrolet's job?

One could argue it's positioned against the Malibu, since the BPG dealers are competing against Chevy more than other automakers..

Because GM still really does not get it.

That statement was based on comments made by "industry sources"... not GM. GM will not be positioning this car directly against Accord or Camry. YES that is Malibu's job.

I'm sure GM's official position of the Regal will be more aspirational.

No idea..financial constraints, probably. Anyone know when is the Insignia-based Regal going into production in China? 2009?

It's already on sale.

http://newregal.buick.com.cn/

http://www.buick.com.cn/regal/index.aspx

The whoring of Buick to fleets ended a few years ago.

Tell that to Enterprise, I can rent a Lucerne for $40/day

Tell that to Enterprise, I can rent a Lucerne for $40/day

You know better than this... You've read the umpteen topics and threads discussing Buick's fleet numbers and percentages.

I did not say Buicks are not sold to fleets... but the numbers are lower than many competitors (inside and outside of GM.)

That statement was based on comments made by "industry sources"... not GM. GM will not be positioning this car directly against Accord or Camry. YES that is Malibu's job.

I'm sure GM's official position of the Regal will be more aspirational.

GM's position often doesn't match up to market reality. They may aspire for the Regal to compete with imports but it will likely be a Malibu, Milan competitor (assuming the Mercury is still alive then). Buick still fleets sedans at a pretty good rate, Honda is only 2% fleet.

GM's position often doesn't match up to market reality. They may aspire for the Regal to compete with imports but it will likely be a Malibu, Milan competitor (assuming the Mercury is still alive then). Buick still fleets sedans at a pretty good rate, Honda is only 2% fleet.

Honda is the only mainstream import manufacturer with low fleet sales... Even then, about as many Accords go to fleets as LaCrosses...

Try comparing actual numbers from Toyota, Hyundai, Kia, Chrysler, Ford, etc... to Buick.

EDIT: Here's help if you need it...

Jan'08-June'08 Fleet sales

LaCrosse - 4,546

Accord - 4,302

Edited December 11, 200816 yr by VenSeattle

GM:

When the heck are you going to learn?

FWD must die in your "upscale" products!

GM:

When the heck are you going to learn?

FWD must die in your "upscale" products!

The 2010 SRX and 2012 DTS hate that idea.

No idea..financial constraints, probably. Anyone know when is the Insignia-based Regal going into production in China? 2009?

Regardless if it'll be a Buick, Pontiac, or Saturn, why didn't GM NA plan this from the get go? 2011 is waaay too late.

The new Regal, assembled near Shanghai, is already in Chinese showrooms.

Same thing with the new Fiesta, which is locally produced in both Europe and China.

Apart from the tacked-on fender vents, looks good to me... it'll make a wonderful Buick and like change Americans perception of the brand...

Edited December 11, 200816 yr by empowah

Sorry, that interior is so poorly-assembled and/or frankly cheap-looking. I can't tell if it is actually poorly-assembled, or just designed to look that way. It better be upgraded for NA if Buick is to be "premium" in any loose sense of the word.

Sorry, that interior is so poorly-assembled and/or frankly cheap-looking. I can't tell if it is actually poorly-assembled, or just designed to look that way. It better be upgraded for NA if Buick is to be "premium" in any loose sense of the word.

Agreed...I do not understand why the Insignia's interior gets such praise...

The interior is too European-looking to fit in a Buick. Enclave and new LaCrosse are much more in tune.

Although I think this interior is okay, the best interiors GM has come up with lately LT2 Malibu, CTS, for example) use more 'two-toning.'

This 'Regal' interior is too much sea-of-grey, like BMers are 'sea-of-black.' If all those little plastic bits have to be moulded and installed separately, would it really be that much more expensive to use contrasting colors to ease up on the boring-ness of the design?

GM:

When the heck are you going to learn?

FWD must die in your "upscale" products!

Not when Lexus, Lincoln, and Acura are out there cranking FWDers and making good money on them.

The Regal is spot on. It's a domestic alternative to a TSX.

or S40

I'll even go out on a limb and say that only 4-cylinders should be offered. Direct injected ecotec base engine and the Turbo DI Ecotech up level engine. Let Buick play off the remnants of turbo history they still have.

Not when Lexus, Lincoln, and Acura are out there cranking FWDers and making good money on them.

SAAB and Volvo also.

Yes, that's where the a large chunk of the entry-premium market is.. the higher-end stuff (Audi, BMW, MB, larger Lexuses, Infiniti) is all RWD and/or AWD, of course, but at the volume end, FWD sells.

SAAB and Volvo also.

Yes, that's where the a large chunk of the entry-premium market is.. the higher-end stuff (Audi, BMW, MB, larger Lexuses, Infiniti) is all RWD and/or AWD, of course, but at the volume end, FWD sells.

well...ifor acuracy's sake, the volume side of the luxury equation belongs to RWD makes and models. FWD acuras and the ES300 are successful, but outside of that, FWD mainstream premium isn't all that big on volume. but i'm sure that's not where you were headed with your post.

Edited December 11, 200816 yr by turbo200

This is stupid, not the idea but the fact that it's going to take so long to get here. Perhaps it will have had an MCE by then.

The TSX and even S40 interiors look much nicer than the Regal's. Perhaps it is getting an MCE before it comes here and that is why it's going to take so long.

The TSX and even S40 interiors look much nicer than the Regal's. Perhaps it is getting an MCE before it comes here and that is why it's going to take so long.

I know it's simply an opinion, but what makes the TSX and S40 so much nicer? The imported badges?

If anything, I think the Regal and TSX look close enough to be related. I drive an S40 regularly, and the interior is nice, but rather stark.

I'll even go out on a limb and say that only 4-cylinders should be offered. Direct injected ecotec base engine and the Turbo DI Ecotech up level engine. Let Buick play off the remnants of turbo history they still have.

I think the turbo 2.8L V6 should be offered with AWD, eventually as a new GNX. Let the LaCrosse be more plush and use the smaller more nimble car to offer a better handling version.

and for the 10000000000000000th time: it'd be better to glue some Enclave portholes on the side of the hood than use those silly fender vents.

I'll even go out on a limb and say that only 4-cylinders should be offered. Direct injected ecotec base engine and the Turbo DI Ecotech up level engine. Let Buick play off the remnants of turbo history they still have.

+1

I know it's simply an opinion, but what makes the TSX and S40 so much nicer? The imported badges?

If anything, I think the Regal and TSX look close enough to be related. I drive an S40 regularly, and the interior is nice, but rather stark.

The TSX in particular just looks much more well-finished and the design seems much more upscale to me. The Regal's looks a lot like the current Aura interior with extra buttons and a NAV screen at the top:

It is obviously just based on personal preference, but I don't see anything great about the Regal interior.

The TSX in particular just looks much more well-finished and the design seems much more upscale to me. The Regal's looks a lot like the current Aura interior with extra buttons and a NAV screen at the top:

It is obviously just based on personal preference, but I don't see anything great about the Regal interior.

I'm going to press you on this simply because I'm trying to understand the thought process. I'm not saying the Regal is decidedly upscale, but neither is the TSX nor the S40.

What makes this more finished? And how does your description of the Regal interior not also apply to the TSX?

I like this idea.

The Regal is spot on. It's a domestic alternative to a TSX.

or S40

Yeah.....but frankly Buick has no where near the brand cache to bring these consumers into the showroom.

Neither does Pontiac, in my opinion.

I don't pretend to know the answer......but I could never see this car working as a Buick. Actually, that's scary because if a car this good can't work as a Buick, will anything ever again?