WOW    .....I was just doing a little poking around that Lexus forum that had the pictures......check out this poll for owners problems with their current ES.  Don't forget to look at the # of voters = 227.  There are 565 problems just from those 227 voters on just the problems listed.....I wonder how many problems would have been listed if there was an "other" catagory??   :

http://www.clublexus.com/forums/showthread.php?t=135072

There were minor problems listed on the Monte Carlo forum I used to belong to, and on the current Chrysler LX (300/Magnum/Charger) forum.....but nothing to the extent of the problems listed on that Lexus ES thread.  What pieces of junk.  How can those people on there rag on American car quality, and then completely overlook the pieces of crap that they are driving??

There are whole forums dedicated to the dreaded Lexus 5 speed transmission problem.... Check out the Edmunds forums for Lexus. It's not the just the ES, the used the same tranny in the Camry and I think the Sienna. That's why all the Lexus enthusiasts are so damned happy to see that new 6 speed show up!

Edited January 30, 200620 yr by Bluesman

There are whole forums dedicated to the dreaded Lexus 5 speed transmission problem....  Check out the Edmunds forums for Lexus.  It's not the just the ES, the used the same tranny in the Camry and I think the Sienna.  That's why all the Lexus enthusiasts are so damned happy to see that new 6 speed show up!

How about 26% of owners with oil leaks?

or 49% with burned out instrument needles or lights

31% of owners with transmission problems

15% of owners with motor mount problems

If this was a Big 3 vehicle......it would be considered a lemon!

Yes, that's what I'm talking about.  There seems to be this double standard that only applies to foreign brands who are experiencing well deserved growth.  Where do you think Toyota learned this platform sharing technique!?

So if we can all agree that the luxury makes all have similar characteristics between models, and they're all executing the same strategy, then this really becomes a non-argument...... Doesn't it?

Yes, there is definitely a double standard... too many people on here have drunk the GM Kool-Aid and can't rationally, objectively view other brands.

Edited January 30, 200620 yr by moltar

WOW    .....I was just doing a little poking around that Lexus forum that had the pictures......check out this poll for owners problems with their current ES.  Don't forget to look at the # of voters = 227.  There are 565 problems just from those 227 voters on just the problems listed.....I wonder how many problems would have been listed if there was an "other" catagory?? :

http://www.clublexus.com/forums/showthread.php?t=135072

There were minor problems listed on the Monte Carlo forum I used to belong to, and on the current Chrysler LX (300/Magnum/Charger) forum.....but nothing to the extent of the problems listed on that Lexus ES thread.  What pieces of junk.  How can those people on there rag on American car quality, and then completely overlook the pieces of crap that they are driving??

No serious automotive enthusiast would find this surprising...

WOW    .....I was just doing a little poking around that Lexus forum that had the pictures......check out this poll for owners problems with their current ES.  Don't forget to look at the # of voters = 227.  There are 565 problems just from those 227 voters on just the problems listed.....I wonder how many problems would have been listed if there was an "other" catagory??   :

http://www.clublexus.com/forums/showthread.php?t=135072

There were minor problems listed on the Monte Carlo forum I used to belong to, and on the current Chrysler LX (300/Magnum/Charger) forum.....but nothing to the extent of the problems listed on that Lexus ES thread.  What pieces of junk.  How can those people on there rag on American car quality, and then completely overlook the pieces of crap that they are driving??

I think you need to consider the perspective there. Those responses are from Lexus owners across all production years, meaning there may be some really old cars lumped into that informal survey. I guess if someone asked me to list all the problems I've had over the last 10 years and 230,300 miles on my 96' Chevy Lumina, then I'd have a long list of problems as well.....

Light bulbs

Brakes

Ball joints

Tie rod ends

Water pump

Alternator

belt tensioner & pulley

Intake gasket

Rear exhaust manifold

Turn signal switch

Cruise control servo

IAC valve

Throttle position sensor

Both cup holders

Fuel pump

Plus regular maintenance items....

I think it's safe to assume that most of the posters in that forum are younger people with older Leuxs cars, i.e. they'll have more problems to report as the vehicles age.

Edited January 30, 200620 yr by Bluesman

275hp 6spd auto, I'd love to see the faces of 330i owners when they get their asses handed to them buy a Camry/ES350

.....like they will even care.......

B)

BMWs are SO much more than just acceleration numbers........and BMW drivers know that....

Not that bad, I'll admit. Still not a fan of Lexus's L-Finesse styling themes. (The name "L-Finesse" sounds like a very feminine shampoo if you ask me.) It's a sleepy-eyed attempt to rip-licate BMW's Flame Surfacing.

I'll hold further judgement for the official photos.

The front looks amazing.  From head on, it is much more engaging than the Lucerene.

So, why are all these people getting excited about the new ES?  Maybe because they are Toyota enthusiasts, just like you guys are GM enthusiasts.  Remember how all of us got excited about the Lucerene?  The Lucerene is the same as this, a FWD luxury cruiser.

Yes, it is built on the Camry platform.  Your point?  If that is the only "bad" thing you can say about it...

I agree 100%. This is a great looking car, from the pics shown so far. Period.

.....like they will even care.......

B)

BMWs are SO much more than just acceleration numbers........and BMW drivers know that....

And while BMW's can be quick, they have never been known for acceleration numbers.

Edited January 31, 200620 yr by Nick

Hey guys, here's the first full shots of the new ES350.

http://www.carspyshots.net/zerothread?id=14998&page=11

Well that is a letdown compared to the front end pics we've seen. Maybe its the anonymous silver colour and the interior would look better black but it only looks marginally better than the ES330. And the little curve at the top of the center console is weird.

No mistaken the Camry there... it even has the bulbous nose.

Shrugs. Someone will buy it, but it sure as hell not me.

I don't like that triangular thing happening with the whole hood coming down towards the front bumper.

I like the center stack, but the arc on the top, (which I immediately said, ENCLAVE!) is way exaggerated and almost looks interferring. If it was a tad more shallow, I don't think it would have been a problem.

Alright, better than the last ES which I didn't care for, but NOT a huge fan. HATE the taillamp treatment and where they put the directional lights.

I like the old interior better...

Do we know if this car is any bigger than the current ES?

The new Camry is pretty much the same size, yet packaged better, so I imagine this will be the same.

Thanks, Bluesman.

My thoughts: It's not bad. It's an evolutionary design that does well for its intended audience. I like the front end better than any other "L-Finesse" vehicle (yeah, I agree with the poster who said it's what the LS should have been). It looks smaller than it is. (Did they raise the roofline or something?) Just like the Camry, I see new-Hyundai in the rear end (not a good thing), and the interior is nice (not stunningly beautiful, as predicted). That huge oval-shaped center stack is weird (I'm not too fond of most of Lexus' new interior designs anyway, and this continues with their weird shapes and lines). I'm also wondering why they put a sporty 3-spoke steering wheel in a FWD cruiser. So overall, not a bad effort.

Edited January 31, 200620 yr by El Scorcho

And while BMW's can be quick, they have never been known for acceleration numbers.

Yes..the appeal is all about the total package...handling, steering feel, braking.. at least that's the appeal of my old E36 M3 to me.. acceleration is ok, but I'm not into drag racing.

Anyhoo, the new ES looks like it will be a nice entry-lux daily driver type of car.. not exactly my cup of tea, but quite good at what it does...if I were going for a FWD daily driver, though, my preference would be a TL with the 6-speed manual (sportier but still well-equipped).

Edited January 31, 200620 yr by moltar

Here are pics of the new ES350. I think it looks great. Especially the rear. The inside's nice too.

I like the center stack, but the arc on the top, (which I immediately said, ENCLAVE!) is way exaggerated and almost looks interferring.  If it was a tad more shallow, I don't think it would have been a problem.

I was going to say the same thing but then I thought, they're just trying to be different. Original.. It's hard to do something that somebody hasn't already done these days.. They could have copied off of somebody else, I suppose..

It looks like a Scion Tc.....and all of the Lexi look the same now.

Looks good..strong family resembalance to the IS. Doesn't seem to have the usual awkward FWD front proportions either...

Well... I take back what I said about the front. I can definitely see the Camry in it, which is definitely not a good thing as it's bulbous and ugly. This seems to be no diferent. Atleast it does have a family resemblence... even if they're all half weirdly, quarter blandly, and a quarter bolbously styled.

Its very ass-heavy, like J-Lo ass-heavy. Unlike J-Lo, its unattractive.

Lexus 2007,

IS250

2.5L 204hp V-6

IS350

3.5L 306hp V-6

ES 350

3.5L 268hp V-6

GS350

3.5L 306hp V-6

GS460

4.6L 380hp V-8

LS460

4.6L 380hp V-8(upgrade to 408hp 2008 with V-12 on the way?)

Its very ass-heavy, like J-Lo ass-heavy. Unlike J-Lo, its unattractive.

J-Lo is attractive!?!? Perhaps in an interstate off ramp sort of way....

Edited January 31, 200620 yr by Bluesman

I am very disappointed that the ES's styling tradition was abandoned and the headlights won't be stretched to the A-pillar and the taillights to the rear wheelwell!

I love your special brand of Sarcasm. LOL

Bluesman:

That interior is ridiculous. Love the Q-tip shaped center-console/stack.

I'm sure the Mice will buy them up like '64.5 Stangs.

Wow, that's the first Lexus interior I've ever seen that I like. Overall, I think the new ES will be very competitive.

Lucerne what?

After the IS, this is my second favorite new Lexus design. The interior looks great and so does the exterior. I think the new design will not attract the bluehairs as much as the current one does.

Honestly, does that really look better than this:

The passenger side looks too spartan in the new one, and the center console is too skinny (yet the Camry center console is really wide?).

I don't like how it looks like the center stack is recessed because of the half-circle thing at the top. It looks like it was designed before the current one's interior because it looks recessed. I agree the current interior is better.

As for the exterior: The front actually reminds me of the pre-2007 Camry and the profile looks like a stylized Camry. The rear looks okay, but nothing about the rest says "I'm a $40k car." It just doesn't look that substantial compared to other luxury makes.

Overall, an ok effort, but could be better. The interior is somewhat feminine and plain looking. I like the interior of the outgoing model better. The exterior has that squashed roof look that Toyota seems to be adopting. My favorite ES exterior was the third generation.

IMO, this was the best ES gen:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/2001-LEXUS-...1QQcmdZViewItem

IMO, this was the best ES gen:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/2001-LEXUS-...1QQcmdZViewItem

I don't like that one, the center console looks so cheap.

I do like the new looks of the new ES, but not sure because I like the interior of the current one too. (the exterior of the current one is too "camry" for me).

Lexus just built a better Buick....... The new ES 350.

http://www.lexus.com/2007es_preview/index.html

http://pressroom.toyota.com/Releases/View?...YT2006020714731

It looks great. And the interior's really, really nice.

In order to keep the forums tidy, continue discussion here:

http://www.cheersandgears.com/forums/index...?showtopic=5719