It seems to be the topic of the day, so what're your thoughts on it?

Here's a link to a video of part of it and a news discussion:

http://video.msn.com/v/us/v.htm?g=51ada60c...t=s3&f=06/64&p=

And this may or may not need to be said but just to be safe, keep it civil.

And here's what Bush has to say on the matter...

WASHINGTON - The national anthem should be sung in English — not Spanish — President Bush declared Friday, amid growing restlessness over the millions of immigrants here illegally

"One of the things that's very important is, when we debate this issue, that we not lose our national soul," the president exclaimed. "One of the great things about America is that we've been able to take people from all walks of life bound as one nation under God. And that's the challenge ahead of us."

A Spanish language version of the national anthem was released Friday by a British music producer, Adam Kidron, who said he wanted to honor America's immigrants.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20060428/ap_on_...national_anthem

i should be illegal to be here illegaly! my great grandparents went throught the process so can they. and whats with the mexico flag? if you like it go back there if its so great.

i should be illegal to be here illegaly! my great grandparents went throught the process so can they.

Um, no. They can't. The US won't allow them to. If they were allowed to immigrate legally, they would.

Illegal immigration isn't the problem, it's a symptom. The poverty in Latin American countries and the huge disparity in wealth between them and the US is a much bigger problem. On one side of the border, you have a poor country with no jobs available, and on the other, you have the richest country in the world with plenty of jobs readily available. What do you really expect a person to do?

Um, no.  They can't.  The US won't allow them to.  If they were allowed to immigrate legally, they would. 

Illegal immigration isn't the problem, it's a symptom.  The poverty in Latin American countries and the huge disparity in wealth between them and the US is a much bigger problem.  On one side of the border, you have a poor country with no jobs available, and on the other, you have the richest country in the world with plenty of jobs readily available.  What do you really expect a person to do?

And yet the great irony is Mexico's very own harsh illegal immigration policy.

with plenty of jobs readily available.

o rly?

How come our unemloyment rate is getting worse. I know alone 12 freinds that lost there jobs in the past year. And they werent fired and not even in the auto indusrty!

o rly?

How come our unemloyment rate is getting worse. I know alone 12 freinds that lost there jobs in the past year. And they werent fired and not even in the auto indusrty!

Hate to spoil your rant, but unemployment in the US has gone down in the past year. In fact it's lower now than it has been since early 2001.

Edited April 29, 200619 yr by Endo

The national anthem whould forever be english, and the spanish noobs should all learn our nation's language.

Um, no.  They can't.  The US won't allow them to.  If they were allowed to immigrate legally, they would. 

Illegal immigration isn't the problem, it's a symptom.  The poverty in Latin American countries and the huge disparity in wealth between them and the US is a much bigger problem.  On one side of the border, you have a poor country with no jobs available, and on the other, you have the richest country in the world with plenty of jobs readily available.  What do you really expect a person to do?

Get in line like poor people in every other country that is not connected to the U.S. Illegal immigration is the problem and it needs to be solved immediately.

o rly?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

im getting user posted image but is this what you ment

i new this was coming.

Once again, it's bull&#036;h&#33;, it should be English, and those damn immigrants should be required to learn English, it' our nation's national anthem, and our nation's official language. Don't like it? Then get the f@#k out!!!!

The US doesn't have an official language. And complex international issues can't be simplified down to "learn to talk English good like us or get the f@#k out!"

The US doesn't have an official language.  And complex international issues can't be simplified down to "learn to talk English good like us or get the f@#k out!"

Of course it's not that simple, but I suppose next you're gonna tell me there's no official national athem? riiiight

No, see, that would be dumb. But I don't think there's any law against people putting their own spin on a song, even if it is unofficial. Besides, immigrants wouldn't be the first group to adopt their own alternate national anthem.

No, see, that would be dumb.  But I don't think there's any law against people putting their own spin on a song, even if it is unofficial.  Besides, immigrants wouldn't be the first group to adopt their own alternate national anthem.

Of course not...when was the last time you actually heard the "doth" in it? Most people change it to "does." Oh no they're ruining it!!!

I look at the whole thing this way: Bush can comment on language once he learns to speak English himself.

Of course not...when was the last time you actually heard the "doth" in it?

Or sing all 4 verses . . . .

It's difficult to do business with some customers because they cannot speak English. People who come here should start to learn English before they emigrate so they can live a full life once here. English has been our predominant language since our country's founding and it will remain so. I am not picking on Spanish-speaking people only, but anyone from anywhere who comes here expecting to stay.

im getting user posted image but is this what you ment

i new this was coming.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Actually, the one I posted said, "Not Rly". But whatever. It's still a damn owl, brown or white.

This one is pretty cool:

(Sigh, I feel like an ass for trying to provide comic relief. )

I bemember those commercials. That's funny stuff. Those owls always make me laugh.

This is absurd. How can one country be "united" when two languages

separate the population. I came here from Slovakia legaly and

learned english, so did the rest of my family. I have friends from

Brazil, Hungary & even a few from Spanish speaking countries and

all of them have learned english and function well in our country.

This is absurd. How can one country be "united" when two languages

separate the population.

Perhaps you should ask Canada,...

or Switzerland...

or India...

But seriously, these immigrants (or at least their children) will learn English, just like all the previous immigrants to this country. My Grandfather was born in this country to German immigrants and still he didn't speak anything but German until he began school.

This "Nuestro Himno" isn't a big deal. It's not even a direct translation, just an inspired song set to the same tune and designed to get people on both sides riled up and/or pissed off. Looks like it worked.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nuestro_Himno

"This is not the first time that the National Anthem has been translated into another language by ethnic and immigrant groups in the United States. In 1861, it was translated into German [3] (and is also on that page in Latin). It has been translated into Yiddish by Jewish immigrants[4]and into French by Cajuns.[5]. The website of the US State Department also has been providing mutliple Spanish versions of the anthem. "

It's difficult to do business with some customers because they cannot speak English.  People who come here should start to learn English before they emigrate so they can live a full life once here.  English has been our predominant language since our country's founding and it will remain so.  I am not picking on Spanish-speaking people only, but anyone from anywhere who comes here expecting to stay.

Of course, businesses who cater to those speaking other languages have some real comparative advantages as the foreigners see them as welcoming and accomodating and therefore get their business. Money talks, and it is more cost effective to hire multilingual employees than to lose the business of foreign customers.

Since the US does not have an official language, English has no more official status than Spanish or Swahili.

English is a majority in the US and people tend to go with the majority.

like...

Cars no one still has horse and buggy unless a car is against there religon

Cell phones

Computers

Internet

Homes (who perfers to sleep under a tree in a rain storm

Electricity

Running water

And there is no way you can say those aren't majorities.

So my point is that people Tend to go with the majority. even if they arent acustom to it.

And yet with all the hoopla, people tend to forget the facts. We not only have an official Spanish-language National Anthem, but four.

US State Department

This new one is crap not for the tongue its sung in, but because of the liberties - no pun intended - taken with the original context of the Anthem. Plus, the little pieces of Puerto Rican rap influences in it are mystifying and irritating.

Once again, it's bull&#036;h&#33;, it should be English, and those damn immigrants should be required to learn English, it' our nation's national anthem, and our nation's official language. Don't like it? Then get the f@#k out!!!!

you and i AGREE?

why do the french canucks always want to separate then?

Perhaps you should ask Canada,...

or Switzerland...

or India...

But seriously, these immigrants (or at least their children) will learn English, just like all the previous immigrants to this country.  My Grandfather was born in this country to German immigrants and still he didn't speak anything but German until he began school.

This "Nuestro Himno" isn't a big deal.  It's not even a direct translation, just an inspired song set to the same tune and designed to get people on both sides riled up and/or pissed off.  Looks like it worked.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nuestro_Himno

"This is not the first time that the National Anthem has been translated into another language by ethnic and immigrant groups in the United States. In 1861, it was translated into German [3] (and is also on that page in Latin). It has been translated into Yiddish by Jewish immigrants[4]and into French by Cajuns.[5]. The website of the US State Department also has been providing mutliple Spanish versions of the anthem. "

you and i AGREE?

lol stranger things have happened

No, see, that would be dumb.  But I don't think there's any law against people putting their own spin on a song, even if it is unofficial.  Besides, immigrants wouldn't be the first group to adopt their own alternate national anthem.

Come to California (or Arizona for that matter) and see how illegal immigrants have impacted our state......

It's a WHOLE different world from N.C.....

It needs to stop.....we need to prosecute companies and individuals that employ them....and we need to spend money on interior enforcement to start sending them back.

And PLEASE realize....there is a BIG difference between "legal" immigrants here and "illegal" immigrants....even amongst the hispanics.

Come see how once powerful cities like Santa Ana (population 300K + and 75% hispanic) have been turned into a downtrodden hispanic-extension of Mexico.

I never gave it another thought until I started living here and experiencing the effects for myself....

If you want an interesting listen on this topic, go to this link.....

It's the "John and Ken Show" from KFI-640am in Los Angeles. Click on the audio archive for "John and Ken on Fox 11."

John and Ken host a highly-rated afternoon-drive-time talk show here in L.A. discussing current news events, both political and nonpolitical. They are outspoken and opinionated....but always provide solid facts and logical commentary to support their discussions...

This was an interview Fox News did with John and Ken about the May 1 "boycott" rallies and on the illegal immigration issue in general.

http://www.johnandkenshow.com/audio.php?offset=0&per_page=15

The next audio archive down, "Linda Swope, CES Inc" is another good one to listen too......

You can also access the "audio archives" by simply going to "johnandkenshow.com"

Ok, listened to that first couple things from John and Ken, and while most of it was basic talk radio BS, there were a couple interesting points brought up. One, the fact that they pointed out that the bigger problem is with the Mexican government and the fact that the country's in such poor shape.

The second major question is a much trickier one, about the fact that several of the problems with American-Mexican relations date back to Manifest Destiny and the US's aggression towards Mexico. They dismissed it pretty quickly, saying that there's a statute of limitations on how long someone can be held accountable for such actions, but I think that's a pretty glib interpretation. When things like that happen and huge disparities are created, there's an echo effect that occurs throughout generations that someone's gotta pay. So who pays? Similar situation: Affirmative Action.

And of course, then there's the fact that several companies are just being pretty despicable with their hiring practices.

But one of my biggest gripes is the desire to blame the immigrants themselves. There's an ages-old tradition of wanting to blame the poor for being poor, and it's proven to be a rather pointless approach. Being able to say that he would never immigrate to America because it is illegal an therefore morally wrong is the luxury of a preson who's never had to face that situation.

As for immigrants learning English, well, practicality and history say they probably will, if not in this generation, then in others. It'll probably have an influence on the evolution of the English language, providing it with more spanish-based words; The English language is very much like a sponge in that regard. But it still makes strong economic sense to encourage bilingualism in businesses, for international commerce. Because if the tide of immigration (legal or otherwise) ends, it will probably be because of one of two factors. Either 1) The US goes psycho in enforcing laws against immigration or 2.) Mexico and other Central American countries become more economically sound and don't have conditions from which people wish to leave. If the latter happens, then it would be in the US's own interest to work more with them. But personally, I think the former would probably be more likely, since the US doesn't seem the least bit interested in helping these other countries, despite the many long-term benefits that we would receive if such a situation were to occur.

Hope that's not too long-winded/incoherent.

Unfortunately, modern immigration differs greatly from historic immigration. Immigrants, legal or otherwise, of the 19th and early 20th century had no choice but to adopt the language and customs of their adopted country, due to the vast distances. Not so today: the internet, cheap phone cards and (relatively) cheap air travel means that the immigrant of today does not have to abandon or leave its native country behind. This results in dual, or at least confused, allegiances.

Secondly, a typical immigrant of the early 20th century probably was no worse off than the average American of that era. Heck, my grandmother didn't get an indoor toilet in her house in suburban Toronto until the late '40s!!! My father got his first job by hot-wiring a bulldozer on a Sunday. The foreman caught him and hired him. Today, you need a highschool dipoloma, computer literacy and a union membership to drive a truck! What favors are we doing these people by lying to them (at our embassies) about the promised land and then resigning them to menial labor because that is all they can get?

Thirdly, at some point critical mass is reached and the immigrant population no longer needs the "indigenous" population. Toronto, promoted as the most "multi-cultural" city in the world is already experiencing this. There are entire neighborhoods without a single English sign. These businesses have decided they don't need to cater to the English majority at all.

I would like to make a personal point, too: my partner is Brazilian. He has struggled with English for 4 years. I took English in university and have been helping him when I can. We don't have children to distract us. Yet, even after 4 years, his English is only now becoming acceptable. He still would not be empoyable in most jobs. I have tried learning Portuguese and it isn't easy!

How are these people going to learn when they have 4 screaming kids and work 14 hour days in a factory? We are creating an underclass in both our countries that we are going to pay dearly for in the coming decades.

Is it really worth it to have a $5 an hour cleaner or a nanny to look after your kids?

There is also a big difference between the illegal coming here because they want to live in America and the illegal coming here simply to work and not contribute. That's needs to be said, too.

Also, place the blame where it belongs - the employers. If they'd crack down and put some paper-pushing white collar middle managers in jail, you'd see a farther-reaching impact than any wall or legislation. Take away the availability of jobs, and a big portion of the illegal immigration ceases. You end up with a comparable trickle of illegals from all nations who simply want to become part of American society and cannot wait. That, we can deal with as a nation.

Croc, sir, could you please do me a favor? Could you maybe switch to posting in spanish? Because I can't read spanish and that might really help my blood pressure. Thanks in advance!

Croc, sir, could you please do me a favor?  Could you maybe switch to posting in spanish?  Because I can't read spanish and that might really help my blood pressure.  Thanks in advance!

Wow, it isn't healthy to harbor so much ill will toward me. My posts increase your blood pressure? That's not good. You should see your doctor. Or maybe you should stop harassing me online like I have asked you to numerous times. I think it's hilarious you give me so much power that just my mere posting is enough to send you into a tizzy. You need to get over it, buddy.

I knew I could incite a response like this. Thanks for being so predictable.

I knew I could incite a response like this.  Thanks for being so predictable.

For what it is worth, think about this..............

Subject: Illegal Immigrants

WASHINGTON (AFP) Immigrants' rights advocates, elated by the resounding

success of Monday's "National Day of Action," which drew the backing of

hundreds of thousands of protesters across the United States, now are

planning a national boycott which they hope will have an even greater

resonance. Organizers are planning the May 1 "Great American Boycott,"

urging illegal immigrants -- who cannot vote and who have only limited

political power -- to flex their economic muscle.

Protesters are being urged to refrain from shopping, and to stay away

from school and work.

You should take a moment to let that sink in.

>

This is a movement orchestrated by people who entered the US

illegally,and then want to scream about their "rights." WHAT RIGHTS?

YOU DON'T EVEN BELONG HERE!

Let's take a look at some of the many benefits that illegal aliens have

blessed our great country with: Street gangs, graffiti, drugs,

skyrocketing health care, depreciation of property value, illiteracy.

The list could go on. What they actually have to offer (cheap labor)

pales to what they have given our country to deal with. I'll take

expensive vegetables over expensive health care any day!

And now, like terrorists, they are going to attack our economy -- the

one entity that makes our nation stand out from all the others. The

backbone of our nation. The country they came to like locusts so they could

reap the benefits is now the focus of their boycott. You've seen it on

TV:

Marching on our American streets waving their Mexican flags, boldly

showing that they can be more racist than those who they accuse of being

racist, and yet the

obvious is totally oblivious to them......

IF YOU'VE GOT IT SO BAD HERE, THEN LEAVE!!!

To all the real Americans, you can do one small thing on May 1st, 2006.

It won't be racist, nor will it be violent. It will not be

boastful,arrogant, selfish, nor distasteful. It will not be any of those

things

that our "guests" have already displayed. What it will do is nullify a

movement.

All you have to do is buy something on May 1st. Make up for what they

will try to take away. It doesn't have to be a new car or house (unless

you were already planning on getting one). It simply needs to be a day

of trading.

Hold off grocery buying until May 1st.Take your wife out to eat that night.

Get the kids pizza, hamburgers, whatever!

Make several trips to the convenience store.

Buy your meals at work.

Fill up your tank.

Shop for clothes, furniture, outdoor equipment.

If it needs to be bought, BUY IT MAY 1st!

Those are just a few suggestions. We're not asking you to spend your

inheritance that day, but just to spend more than you normally would.

Even if it's only a few dollars, this will help soften the blow that the

illegal Mexicans will try to inflict on our economy that day. It sounds

trivial

at first, but if this idea gets around, what the illegal Mexicans set out to

do

will fail.

NOW COMES THE HARD PART:

This email will not self-destuct if you don't send it to someone. It

will not cause bad luck, nor will it make you impotent. It will not do

some trick or show a cute little animation if you send it to "X" amount

of people.

You will not get paid for doing it.

It will not spread the message though, if it just gets deleted. Forward

at will.....

If you can read this, thank a teacher and since it's in English, thank

a soldier!

May 1st, eh? Only one problem. It's now the 4th.

Boy, the boat left you behind. Best wait for the next one.

Here's an oldie, but goodie, that most of you probable have never heard!

Theodore Roosevelt's ideas on Immigrants and being an AMERICAN in 1907.

"In the first place, we should insist that if the immigrant who comes here in

good faith becomes an American and assimilates himself to us, he shall be

treated on an exact equality with everyone else, for it is an outrage to

discriminate against any such man because of creed, or birthplace, or origin.

But this is predicated upon the person's becoming in every facet an American,

and nothing but an American ... There can be no divided allegiance here. Any man

who says he is an American, but something else also, isn't an American at all.

We have room for but one flag, the American flag ... We have room for but one

language here, and that is the English language ... and we have room for but one

sole loyalty and that is a loyalty to the American people."

Theodore Roosevelt 1907

............And that's the truth!!!!!!

May 1st, eh? Only one problem. It's now the 4th.

Boy, the boat left you behind. Best wait for the next one.

Idiot! That is when this article was published. I did not alter it for you

who are unable to think!

Idiot! That is when this article was published. I did not alter it for you

who are unable to think!

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Geeze! What's up with the attitude, eh? I was being scarcastic.