The Ev road trip to kentucky is worthwhile...

Old Cadillac content, and love the song...what's not to love. I have posted this efore, but it ages well. 

 

One more Tesla road trip video. want to explore out west when this pandemic dies down a bit. 

 

This is so funny of a puppy looking at an a guy on the toilet.

Puppy stares at stranger from underneath stall in public bathroom (msn.com)

Wait -
audi e-tron costs you $34 to 'fill up' every 200 or so miles?

15 hours ago, A Horse With No Name said:

Now if I could just get that in a bse trim, I might pay a visit to my local jeep dealer with checkbook in hand. 

yeah, but almost too pretty to take off road. But yes, drop dead gorgeous. 

That gray or green in a GC works for me....

26 minutes ago, balthazar said:

Wait -
audi e-tron costs you $34 to 'fill up' every 200 or so miles?

Where did ya read this, that is crazy as I have never seen an EV cost that much to recharge the battery.

1 hour ago, oldshurst442 said:

Incredible.  I would love to take ViaRail, Canada's national railway system, across Canada and through the Canadian Rockies and view a lot of it from the dome car.

- - - - -

I hope everyone had a nice Thanksgiving.

Here's the drill:  buffet - tryptophan - nap - rinse (decompress) - do not repeat, at least for a good while ...

11 hours ago, balthazar said:

An epic vehicle that made so much sense and that Cadillac dialed just right.  As for this one, I prefer the stock grille to the one shown and think much darker burgundy leather seats would be better than these bright red ones.

I would like to experience riding in one ... or driving one.  It would be interesting to see how well Cadillac retained the Cadillac in a significantly smaller vehicle.

Edited November 27, 20205 yr by trinacriabob

Ok, you look at current goings-on and see some shocking negative news about someone famous during this long Thanksgiving holiday weekend.

Four years ago on this same long Thanksgiving holiday weekend, there was high profile news about another famous person.

Within the last few days, soccer star Diego Maradona of Argentina died.  He died of heart failure and was 60.  This is the guy who led Argentina to the World Cup victory in 1986 and was depicted on the side of an Aerolineas Argentinas 747.  After his soccer career ended, he dealt with addiction, poor health, poor habits, significant weight gain, and a lot of drama.  Before any burial, his casket was at the Casa Rosada, the one with the balcony from which Eva Peron addressed the people, so that the mourning fans of Buenos Aires and Argentina could pay their respects.

At about the same time 4 years ago, Fidel Castro died.  In contrast, Miami's Little Havana district was roaring with celebrations.  I was in South Florida for Thanksgiving that year - booked months in advance - and happened to see it.

Castro and Diego Maradona were friends.  Castro invited Diego Maradona to Cuba and Maradona supposedly went there as his guest.

I wanted to check the dates.  They both died on November 25, though  4 years apart.

Sad news about Diego Maradona.  I wasn't expecting to come across something like this anytime soon.

1 hour ago, David said:

Where did ya read this, that is crazy as I have never seen an EV cost that much to recharge the battery.

The video at the top of this page, from Insideevs. 
 

Interesting; first the maintenance cost issue gets inverted, now here’s an example where fueling it costs more as an electric. 

Huh.

Edited November 27, 20205 yr by balthazar

9 hours ago, oldshurst442 said:

I am more of a CN fan tahn a CP fan, although I like them both CN ownes the old SOO Line/Wisconsin central tracks where I grew up in Wisconsin and learned to love trains. Thankfully CN manages their business well and has put a ton of money into upgrades and is running a whole lot of freight over the rails. Would love to cross Canada on Via rail. the Canadian is the alst remaining traditional streamline train in the world. 

58 Corvette. I can't get enough of these. 

7 hours ago, balthazar said:

The video at the top of this page, from Insideevs. 
 

Interesting; first the maintenance cost issue gets inverted, now here’s an example where fueling it costs more as an electric. 

Huh.

Yeah. I don't think that electrics are going away, but I don't think its going to be a smooth seemless transition to 80 percent electrics by 2025 either. 

The rest of the world, meaning Europe and China, will largely go electric over the nexxt decade and a half. If we want to sell cars there, we need to learn to build electric cars profitably. So far Tesla is only profitable because it sells credits to other carmakers. 

Although they do sell a ton of Model 3's. 

7 hours ago, trinacriabob said:

Ok, you look at current goings-on and see some shocking negative news about someone famous during this long Thanksgiving holiday weekend.

Four years ago on this same long Thanksgiving holiday weekend, there was high profile news about another famous person.

Within the last few days, soccer star Diego Maradona of Argentina died.  He died of heart failure and was 60.  This is the guy who led Argentina to the World Cup victory in 1986 and was depicted on the side of an Aerolineas Argentinas 747.  After his soccer career ended, he dealt with addiction, poor health, poor habits, significant weight gain, and a lot of drama.  Before any burial, his casket was at the Casa Rosada, the one with the balcony from which Eva Peron addressed the people, so that the mourning fans of Buenos Aires and Argentina could pay their respects.

At about the same time 4 years ago, Fidel Castro died.  In contrast, Miami's Little Havana district was roaring with celebrations.  I was in South Florida for Thanksgiving that year - booked months in advance - and happened to see it.

Castro and Diego Maradona were friends.  Castro invited Diego Maradona to Cuba and Maradona supposedly went there as his guest.

I wanted to check the dates.  They both died on November 25, though  4 years apart.

Sad news about Diego Maradona.  I wasn't expecting to come across something like this anytime soon.

Interesting but flawed guys who both made a big impact on the world. Thoughtful perspective. 

Edited November 27, 20205 yr by A Horse With No Name

8 hours ago, daves87rs said:

That gray or green in a GC works for me....

....and an advanced 4WD system could help you navagate Michigan's notoriously shitty roads. I always know when I go from Ohio to Michigan, because the pavement looks like something one would find in a bombed out jungle in Laos or a dirt path one would find in Tibet. 

Apparently Michigan has as much trouble playing football as they do maintaining roads, as Michigan is really having an off year. I say this not to run you or Michigan down, but because I want big ten football to stand up and represent. I normally cheer for any big ten team over any non big ten team, exept for Penn State, because I despise Penn State football. 

We judge/compete with Penn State in debate, and every time I write a win for a pen state debater, I hAve to remind the students that jsut because they won the round....it doesn't mean I like their football team.

Then again an Ox and Cart might be cheaper, and you wouldn't have to put up with the inevitable C and G electric vs. ICE debate. You would have your own alternative fuel powertrain!

Hope you had a Great thanksgiving. 

 

Edited November 27, 20205 yr by A Horse With No Name
Spelling

I don't think I posted this, but I really want a damn Jeep. or Bronco. Wonder what a 55 year old Kidney goes for on the black market?

 

17 hours ago, David said:

H'mmm Most Mom's never look this good months after giving birth, but WOW. Good thing her husband is also a body builder, their daughter is cute and will have good healthy habits growing up.

김해나 ʜᴀᴇɴᴀ ᴋɪᴍ?? (@xhaenax) • Instagram photos and videos

She needs a Tesla with ludicrous mode, so I can watch her move away from me. The view from the back/behind has to be spectacular. 

Edited November 27, 20205 yr by A Horse With No Name

Think this guitar looks fantastic. Not building many at the present because my shop mate Brian got invovled with building a race car. He got it together and has decided to build something else. But this looks damn good IMHO. 

9 hours ago, oldshurst442 said:

See my into the storm 4 wheeling off road video I posted...by a Canadian YouTuber. Canada is gorgeous in the winter. I love this photograph. 

From Bloomberg news, one of the few relatively sane news sources in our country. Interesting take on self driving vehicles being used in farming. Worth a watch IMHO. 

 

Cool Bronco pic...

More worthwhile recovery work...

 

Edited November 27, 20205 yr by A Horse With No Name
Spelling

Two thoughts....trapped babysitting boilers for Thanksgiving, thanks to everyone for putting up with my post slutting here at C and G. I love all of you like (Dysfunctional) brothers. 

Second, this is a bucket lsit car for me, amazing. 

 

A lot of subtle mods to the car....really nice build. As bonus content...notice the Lincoln at about 3:10. 

Edited November 27, 20205 yr by A Horse With No Name

Zenda KS. Would love to restore an old commercial building like this. That's not original lettering, so not sure if it was an actual dealer; Zenda is minuscule and this is a relatively big building for that.

22 minutes ago, balthazar said:

Zenda KS. Would love to restore an old commercial building like this. That's not original lettering, so not sure if it was an actual dealer; Zenda is minuscule and this is a relatively big building for that.

I have seen some killer restorations of buildings like this. Ate fantastic food in a bar from a converted dealer just like this. 

1 hour ago, A Horse With No Name said:

I have seen some killer restorations of buildings like this. Ate fantastic food in a bar from a converted dealer just like this. 

Me too, there is an old car dealership near downtown Phoenix that was converted to a food hall a few years ago w/ several restaurants..very nice. 

Had to think a bit to remember what the name was---DeSoto Central Market..was a former DeSoto dealer...unfortunately, it's since closed.

 

Edited November 27, 20205 yr by Robert Hall

21 minutes ago, Robert Hall said:

Me too, there is an old car dealership near downtown Phoenix that was converted to a food hall a few years ago w/ several restaurants..very nice. 

Better than tearing them down....one of the oldest Ford dealers here in Columbus was torn down, cool art deco building that was an old Cadillac dealership got torn down. Talked about both before here. 

Really beleive in preserving the past...

The same thing was done to the dealer my 2500HD came from- there since '55, closed in '08, now some sort of 'farm fresh deli / eatery' establishment. They did what looks like a nice job, some obvious but minor exterior changes (I've not been inside since the remodel), but I somehow prefer to see the 'car' aspect of the structure maintained, somehow.

6 hours ago, A Horse With No Name said:

I don't think I posted this, but I really want a damn Jeep. or Bronco. Wonder what a 55 year old Kidney goes for on the black market?

 

She needs a Tesla with ludicrous mode, so I can watch her move away from me. The view from the back/behind has to be spectacular. 

Check her post here out, that shows how spectacular it is!

https://www.instagram.com/p/B_bXmK_JFeY/

 

45 minutes ago, balthazar said:

The same thing was done to the dealer my 2500HD came from- there since '55, closed in '08, now some sort of 'farm fresh deli / eatery' establishment. They did what looks like a nice job, some obvious but minor exterior changes (I've not been inside since the remodel), but I somehow prefer to see the 'car' aspect of the structure maintained, somehow.

That is nice...fantastic actually. 

The off road / winter mountain trail busting looks cool, but I have zero interest in putting myself in that sort of scenario.

@DavidHappy Birthday old man lol!

1 hour ago, surreal1272 said:

@DavidHappy Birthday old man lol!

Amazing 53 years, looking forward to the next 53!  

9 hours ago, A Horse With No Name said:

I don't think I posted this, but I really want a damn Jeep. or Bronco. Wonder what a 55 year old Kidney goes for on the black market?

 

 

 

The only Wrangler I do NOT like is the Gladiator. Love the wheels the guy mounted on his Gladiator though.  The 4Runner was great too!  

Isnt snow great lookin' when in the wilderness?   Amongst trees and frozen lakes with snow-covered high mountains in the backround?  Awesome Id say!  

But...

Nothing beats the desolate beach backdrop...

 

 

Just got back from a short job from a long-time & utterly helpless customer. Among the list of things, her smoke detectors had been beeping FOR A WEEK. None are hard wired, 4 older units took 9V, no problem. But the main hallway unit (a Kidde) I put up, after dutifully labeling the install date sticker.
Now... a smoke detector battery sees totally static battery useage. But this sealed lithium battery unit, blatantly labeled as being a "10 year life" (120 months) lasted only 79.

This is why I always doubt battery manufacturer claims. An electric car has dozens of factors that affect battery life. A smoke detector has 1 function and no variables on that function (I guarantee the customer NEVER pressed the test button ONCE).

Happy 53rd @David

Slightly larger scale in old buildings being restored and converted

American Can Company in Montreal  (I grew up in this neighborhood)

 

I dont know if you could tell by this pic, but by the 1970s and 1980s, the building was empty and some of the windows were broken and boarded up. 

Today and for the last 20 years or so,  its a Super C grocery store.

 

2 hours ago, David said:

Amazing 53 years, looking forward to the next 53!  

Happy birthday. Your cake is in the frunk....

1 hour ago, balthazar said:

Just got back from a short job from a long-time & utterly helpless customer. Among the list of things, her smoke detectors had been beeping FOR A WEEK. None are hard wired, 4 older units took 9V, no problem. But the main hallway unit (a Kidde) I put up, after dutifully labeling the install date sticker.
Now... a smoke detector battery sees totally static battery useage. But this sealed lithium battery unit, blatantly labeled as being a "10 year life" (120 months) lasted only 79.

This is why I always doubt battery manufacturer claims. An electric car has dozens of factors that affect battery life. A smoke detector has 1 function and no variables on that function (I guarantee the customer NEVER pressed the test button ONCE).

I always doubt all claims.

2 hours ago, ocnblu said:

You're OK with it because you agree with it.  Those of us who do not agree with it, and wish that one simple rule were equally enforced, are told to deal with it or GTFO.  That's my point.

I would prefer that we ignore it and let Drew delete the post. People loosing thier shit and starting silly fights drives people away from the site.

On 11/27/2020 at 6:31 PM, balthazar said:

Just got back from a short job from a long-time & utterly helpless customer. Among the list of things, her smoke detectors had been beeping FOR A WEEK. None are hard wired, 4 older units took 9V, no problem. But the main hallway unit (a Kidde) I put up, after dutifully labeling the install date sticker.
Now... a smoke detector battery sees totally static battery useage. But this sealed lithium battery unit, blatantly labeled as being a "10 year life" (120 months) lasted only 79.

This is why I always doubt battery manufacturer claims. An electric car has dozens of factors that affect battery life. A smoke detector has 1 function and no variables on that function (I guarantee the customer NEVER pressed the test button ONCE).

How are battery life claims any different from the many bogus MPG claims for ICE autos? Example? Ford and their "Eco" and "Boost" MPG claims.

10 hours ago, A Horse With No Name said:

Have you gotten laid recently.... seriously. You used to be fun and talk about cars. I want the old car lovin' pick up truck liking outdoorsman who was fun to read.

I can't decide if I need to buy you a night with a prostitute or a Silverado. 

Don't take me too seriously...but I do want car/truck loving Bill back.

Have a great evening, dude.

 

He's been a little bitter since November 3rd lol.

 

OH NO! I brought up politics! Don't flog me Blu!

 

Oh right. Not worried about the petty stuff.

50 minutes ago, surreal1272 said:

How are battery life claims any different from the many bogus MPG claims for ICE autos? Example? Ford and their "Eco" and "Boost" MPG claims.

MPG is tested & certified; some vehicles get worse, some get better. A lot of variables in the operation of a combustion-engined vehicle (as in a BEV). I don't know that battery life certification is done, but between batteries & light bulbs, it certainly has been my observation that they commonly fall short with FAR less variables in their operation. You cannot 'hyper mile' a light bulb. It's worthy of some examination, IMO.

Edited November 28, 20205 yr by balthazar

Reality is complex.

38 minutes ago, balthazar said:

MPG is tested & certified; some vehicles get worse, some get better. A lot of variables in the operation of a combustion-engined vehicle (as in a BEV). I don't know that battery life certification is done, but between batteries & light bulbs, it certainly has been my observation that they commonly fall short with FAR less variables in their operation. You cannot 'hyper mile' a light bulb. It's worthy of some examination, IMO.

Yet those “certified” tests very rarely affect real world usage which is the same thing with batteries apparently. That’s my point.

 

And while you can’t “hypermile” a light bulb, you can with a battery in an EV ( like not driving like a bat out of hell at every stop light lol).

Edited November 28, 20205 yr by surreal1272

No- they don't "affect" real world usage, but they give one a window of expectation. It's generally a median.

My question is; are battery ratings a median or a maximum... sometimes?

Why doesn't a sealed, constant-draw battery meet it's claimed lifespan? Why doesn't a minimum-draw LED bulb meet it's? IS it a lack of certification to get these claims to be more realistic?

Remember when Porsche was dialed back from 400 miles of range to 308? (I think I have those numbers right) - Porsche's internal testing / planned marketing was pulled back from the unrealistic.

1 hour ago, balthazar said:

MPG is tested & certified; some vehicles get worse, some get better. A lot of variables in the operation of a combustion-engined vehicle (as in a BEV). I don't know that battery life certification is done, but between batteries & light bulbs, it certainly has been my observation that they commonly fall short with FAR less variables in their operation. You cannot 'hyper mile' a light bulb. It's worthy of some examination, IMO.

I would agree with your assessment that especially in this case, there is profiting at the expense of the consumer. Tesla has done this big time. I have much higher expectations for Rivian as RJ, CEO seems to have a much more common sense and grasp on Reality than Musk.

Time will tell and Auto batteries are on the EPA cycle certification so I would expect as Ford, GM and many others of the old OEMs join the EV race that batteries will have to last the stated life expectancy.

4 hours ago, balthazar said:

No- they don't "affect" real world usage, but they give one a window of expectation. It's generally a median.

My question is; are battery ratings a median or a maximum... sometimes?

Why doesn't a sealed, constant-draw battery meet it's claimed lifespan? Why doesn't a minimum-draw LED bulb meet it's? IS it a lack of certification to get these claims to be more realistic?

Remember when Porsche was dialed back from 400 miles of range to 308? (I think I have those numbers right) - Porsche's internal testing / planned marketing was pulled back from the unrealistic.

Random power outages (or surges) over the course of the 79 months (you stated), will 100% affect that battery. Thats one way to kill a battery prematurely. 

 

And Porsche dialing back that battery range (from their marketing range) is no different than companies that dial back MPGs for the same reason. Just my opinion though. 

13 minutes ago, surreal1272 said:

Random power outages (or surges) over the course of the 79 months (you stated), will 100% affect that battery. Thats one way to kill a battery prematurely. 

It was a battery-ONLY unit; power grid fluctuations are irrelevant.

4 hours ago, balthazar said:

No- they don't "affect" real world usage, but they give one a window of expectation. It's generally a median.

My question is; are battery ratings a median or a maximum... sometimes?

Why doesn't a sealed, constant-draw battery meet it's claimed lifespan? Why doesn't a minimum-draw LED bulb meet it's? IS it a lack of certification to get these claims to be more realistic?

Remember when Porsche was dialed back from 400 miles of range to 308? (I think I have those numbers right) - Porsche's internal testing / planned marketing was pulled back from the unrealistic.

It is very interesting to see what is posted by leaders of various battery companies.

EV focused writeups on EV battery life, but they seem to deal with the same key details as every other type of battery.

How Long Should An Electric Car’s Battery Last? (myev.com)

Just How Long Will An EV Battery Last? (insideevs.com)

Battery Lifetime: How Long Can Electric Vehicle Batteries Last? (cleantechnica.com)

Electric Car Battery Life, Cost of Replacement, Recycling & Leasing | EDF (edfenergy.com)

From hearing aids to laptop batteries there are a variety of interesting  responses, but the consistent thread I read is that depending on consistency of charging, power surges, extreme use versus a consistent use will all affect battery life.

Course cheaper designed batteries tend to not last as long as higher quality batteries.

Life Expectancy of Unused Batteries Tom Begley Batteries 424 (audiologyonline.com) CEO of Ray o Vac batteries talking about hearing aid batteries.

This is solid from Trip Lite, read for the details, but this is consistent.

1. Ambient Temperature

2. Number of Discharges

3. Age

4. Load Sizing

5. Maintenance

5 Factors that will Shorten the Life of Your UPS Battery (tripplite.com)

APC, one of the worlds largest UPS builders and sellers has the following on their battery for life expectancy.

What is the expected life of my APC UPS battery?

Environment:
All Three Phase and Single Phase UPS Models 


Cause / Resolution:
Most APC batteries should last three to five years. There are many factors which affect Battery life including environment and number of discharges. Below are some guidelines to ensure optimum life expectancy:

1. Operating Temperature: The optimum operating temperature for a lead-acid battery is 20-25° C (68-77° F). Elevated temperature reduces longevity. As a guideline, every 8° C (15° F) rise in temperature will cut the battery life in half. A battery which would last for 4 years at 25° C (77° F), will only be good for 2 years if operated at 33° C (95° F). Keep in mind that the battery temperature inside your UPS will always be warmer than the ambient temperature of the location where the UPS is installed.

2. Battery Calibration and Deep Discharge: Only perform runtime calibrations on your UPS one or two times a year, if necessary. Some of our customers want to check their systems to verify that their runtime is sufficient. However, consistently performing these calibrations can significantly decrease the life expectancy of your APC battery.  It is also important to remember that a UPS is not designed for constant deep discharges. We do not reccomend using your APC Smart-UPS/Back-UPS as a portable power supply that is repeatedly discharged/recharged (like on a portable equipment cart). These units are designed for emergency use during unexpected power outages or momentary loss of power. 

3. Storage: Do not store APC batteries for extended periods of time. New batteries/units should be stored for no more than 6 months from date of purchase, as they ship from the factory at approximately 80% charge. After this period, the battery should be used or it will lose a great deal of its charge . It is not advisable to store batteries that have already been in use. Extended storage without periodic charging can result in shortened life expectancy and erratic battery performance.

Temperature also plays a large part in battery degradation during storage:

• If the ambient temperature during storage is - 15°C to + 30°C (+ 5°F to + 86°F), perform a full recharge cycle at least every six months.
• In environments where the ambient temperature is + 30°C to + 45°C (+ 86°F to + 113°F), perform a full recharge cycle at least every three months.

4.  Load: As the load increases on your UPS, the runtime decreases. It is not recommended that the load exceed 80 percent of the UPS unit’s rated capacity. In the event of a power failure, a UPS loaded to full capacity will discharge the battery very quickly and there is a potential that the life expectancy of the battery will be significantly reduced.

My example is an extremely-controlled test. No recharges, no ambient temp changes, no power grid connection, designed/spec’d by segment-leading manufacturer for that unit.

Only reached 67% of claimed battery life.
 

I can’t imagine many factors of EV use that would significantly extend the advertised claims; there are more that would lower it than extend it.