CaddyXLR-V

04 LS

That narrows it down to the Impala or the Regal. Most likely the Regal.

Aurora?

I guess the question here would be: What is more Pontiac? A Chevy rebadged to look like a Pontiac but built in the US, with zero driving excitement, OR A Holden rebadged as a Pontiac built in Australia, with the driving excitement rivalling, or at least coming close to, a BMW My vote goes for the second option.

Unline Conrail, the auto industry is highly politicized currently due to global warming. The auto industry is also much more crowded with too much capacity. GM also has a perception issue to fight as well. The two situations are not the same.

Well if GM knew how to run the company for the past 30 years, they would have never needed to go to the govt begging for money. The problem started with GM management.

I saw what looked like a G37 convertible. They must have one coming out soon. There is a Nissan proving grounds a few miles from my house.

The government will be involved, pre-packaged or not. GM already borrowed $14 billion, and will need more to keep running through bankruptcy. The government will be in control either way.

They will still be around, but you will have to spend a lot of money. Luckily for me, I have my GTO that I'm keeping forever. RWD won't go away, but you will see a lot more I4s and V6s with RWD than you will V8 and RWD.

Let's say GM does raise 60 billion from the stock issuing, which is optimistic, unless the govt is putting up most of it. 27 billion goes to paying off bondholders, 15.4 billion is still owed to the govt, and how much is owed to the unions, 22 billion? Even if only the bondholders and union are paid now, GM will only have 11 billion in cash. That will probably be the bare minimum amount GM needs just to keep running, and there's no telling how long GM will still be burning through cash, or when GM will first turn a profit. GM will lose marketshare with the closure of brands, and will gain competitives with the sale of other brands, in an already saturated market. Will GM still be worth the 60 billion their shares were bought for after all that?

It looks exactly like a G35 coupe

GM would have already been bankrupt if not for govt loans. GM is not worth much at all right now. What do you think GM is worth? $50 billion? Will GM even make a profit within the next ten years, or will some investor(govt) need to keep pumping money in to keep it going? The market value is what the company is worth, when you take the risks GM faces over the next few months into account. Where is Kirk now? He could buy the company for less than $5 billion. Why doesn't he want it? I think the reason is because it's not even worth that, given how much money he would need to put into it to prop it back up.

I disagree. The company isn't worth more, because there is a big chance the shares will be worthless because they can't pay their debt, and will have to file bankruptcy. Those shares will be cancelled, or diluted, when the govt, union, and bondholders get their share. Would you buy GM for $10 billion or more right now, knowing you may have to file bankruptcy in a month, and you will come out owning only 1% of the company?

Never been in one, and don't care to be in one for that matter. But they appear to be larger than a Golf, Civic, or Cobalt, so I classified it as midsize. I'm just not sure if Americans are ready to make the switch to compact cars. Going from an Explorer(which isn't very spacious inside anyway) to a midsize car, isn't as big of a leap as going from a midsize car to a compact car, and I think midsize is the minimum size most Americans are willing to downsize to. Combine that with Buicks traditionally being big cars, and I don't see a compact Buick picking up many sales. They are not going to be peoples first choice when looking to downsize, since it is completely opposite from the image someone gets when they think of Buick.

The Prius is a midsize car with fuel saving technology. To make what I said not true, people would need to be trading in their paid for midsize cars to buy Golfs, and it doesn't seem like that's been the case. They go for the midsize hybrid instead. I'm just saying, given the choice between an Altima hybrid, and a compact Buick for the same price, most people will go for the Altima. Buick would be better off with a full hybrid version of the Malibu.

How big will that market be? American's buy compacts to save money. I would think there would be a bigger market for a midsized car with more fuel saving technology for $25k, than there would be for more premium compact car for $25k. Especially from Buick. People buy Buicks because they are bigger. I think this will be a failure. Buick will never be Acura.

Here is the response I got from GM: Dear Sir or Madam, Thank you for contacting the Pontiac Customer Assistance Center. We appreciate you taking the time to write us regarding your comments on the news of Pontiacs closure. We are grateful for your faith in Pontiac. Anyone who has been associated with the Pontiac brand knows that this was a difficult decision. Pontiac has had a rich and storied history, but unfortunately, despite the efforts of all concerned, the brand has been unprofitable over the past several years. We had hoped in our February 17 Viability Plan to convert Pontiac to a niche brand within the Buick-Pontiac-GMC channel. However, the Viability Plan as submitted was not acceptable. GM was further challenged to take more significant restructuring actions which would allow the company to be viable even in these unprecedented market conditions and in any future cyclical market downturns. These restructuring actions require further sacrifice by all stakeholders: GM employees, suppliers, investors and dealers. As part of these renewed restructuring efforts, we spent considerable time formulating Pontiac portfolio scenarios that would allow the brand to be sustainable and profitable long term. Unfortunately, after careful evaluation, none of these scenarios proved viable. In the meantime, your warranty coverage is safe and sound, and GM dealerships remain open for sales and service. GM values its customers and we appreciate your loyalty. And, we are more committed than ever to making every car and truck we build a winner and to providing the best ownership experience in the industry. More information about the contents of the viability plan is available on www.gmfactsandfiction.com. One of the best things about America is that we have the freedom to openly discuss our personal values, ideas and beliefs. At GM, we recognize that individuals have many different views. Thank you for letting us know how you feel. We hope this email has been most helpful to you. If you should need to contact us in the future, simply reply to this message or call our Pontiac Customer Assistance Center at 1-800-762-2737. Customer Relationship Specialists are available Monday to Saturday, 8 a.m. to 9 p.m. EST, Closed Sunday. Again, thank you for contacting Pontiac. Sincerely, The Pontiac Consumer Support Team

Yes

It's GM's overhead costs and bad management that make anything GM does unprofitable.

Pontiac in the past had enough volume to be a mainstream brand. That means nothing. Pontiac still outsells some mainstream brands. What's your point? Dodge had just as many crap cars as every other American brand. To say they are mainstream, doesn't change that fact. Chrysler made crap cars, Ford, Mercury, Buick, Chevy, Plymouth, Oldsmobile, Cadillac, they all had their share of crap cars, no matter what their missions were. Are you saying it's ok for Dodge to make crap cars, because they aimed for a lower target? Maybe Pontiacs tagline should have been, we make crap cars, because in your mind, they would fit their mission better, and shouldn't be killed because they are fulfilling their mission. My point is, who cares about what they are advertised as? Compare the cars, and the cars alone, and Dodge did no better, or no worse than Pontiac. Just because Pontiac had a higher target, that doesn't make them a bigger failure.

I have already emailed Pontiac to let them know how I feel.

If Dodge was part of GM, Dodge would be a flawed brand behind Chevy also. It's different when people are talking about the brand you care about, isn't it? When I look at Dodge, I see a lot of crap cars for the past 30 years, just like what you see when you look at Pontiac.

No, the bond holders felt they would fare better through the normal bankruptcy process. If you own a business, and you owe banks 40%, your workers 40%, and the govt 20% of the worth of your business, why would the banks only come out with 10% when you offer them equity, while the workers and govt come out with the other 90%? If that was your 40% owed, wouldn't you want as much of it back as possible? Especially when you should be the FIRST in line to get your money back?

With the car makers becoming intertwined with the government, I don't see how talking about politics will be avoided.

The point is, this sets a bad precedent. If banks or investors are afraid this is going to happen again when they make secured loans, they will charge higher rates or not make the loans at all, because there is more risk for them. Put any spin you want on that, it is still bad.