El Kabong

C/D's Lightning Lap Mustang was plagued by engine/power issues. They specifically ragged on it for being overly sensitive to fuel quality. I can only imagine what it would be like in a pickup or whatnot.

And if the pic is anything to go by, it's going to be a mean-looking mere. More at the link: http://www.automobilemag.com/features/news/bugatti-chiron-prototype-reveals-its-mean-front-end/

I think I just watched Peyton Manning lose his job last night.

Unlike your NEW GT/NEW Camaro bit, there was nothing snide about my comment. Well, that's open to debate. To say the least. But as I said previously, this Head2Head is probably not a good thing to be crowing about so much. As far as your off-topic mention of the R&T drivers car thing, there was a guy who wrote a piece on the Camaro SS. He said that ya, the Mustang won, but that was before he drove the Camaro. Dun-dun-dun.

Intelligent discourse is the hallmark of any good forum. That is all that needs to be said in regards to that.

My Mustang had a four-barrel V8 that threw down all of 190hp stock. But times move on.

Indeed. Anyhoo, an extra 40,000 GM passenger trucks per year going into garages is a boon for GM's market share, especially with their half-tons still outstripping the competition as well.

And it doesn't matter... the Camaro5 is done. Even if the video was produced back in September, the Camaro5 had at most 2 months of production left to it. GM was just using up parts at that point. It was an outgoing design on a platform that began development in 1999 and using a 10 year old engine. All of this howling over the "fantastic" flat-plane V8... and for what? 2/10ths of a second to 60 and 1.16 second in a single lap? That is well within the range of driver error in a single lap. 2015-11-28.png Why don't you understand that it is actually a problem that the Mustang just barely beat a car with that kind of age disadvantage? I expect a brand new Ford Mustang GT350R to positively wipe the floor with a 6 year old Camaro chassis that is using a 10 year old engine and last gen Corvette shocks. It didn't..... and that is a problem for the Mustang. I'm not trying to say that the Camaro5 is better... I'm saying I expected a lot more results from the GT350R A) It does matter. The Camaro was not out of production. B) Driver error. Fine. Now the Z/28 is 2+ seconds behind on that specific lap. C) When has any Corvette come with Dynamic Suspension Spool Valve (DSSV) damper system? According to Cammisa, it was a " clear and easy victory ". Im not sure how that equates to barely in your books. If this is the type of victory you're content to hang your hat on then I guess you're just not that picky about what you like. I, on the other hand, will be straight-up mad if GM doesn't have something that'll gong this thing into oblivion for the next few years right around the corner. Excellence of execution must respond swiftly and decisively. Leave catching up to yesterday to the rest. Type of victory I'm content with? I was more content with the GT350R's victory over a Viper ACR, Corvette Z06, 488GTB, ATS-V, AMG GTS etc etc than having the GT350R beat up on a Z/28. The GT350R has shown to be excellence of execution. Well then, if that's he victory you want to hang your hat on... You're off topic. We have a thread for that already. Sheesh. Youse guys :D

Really? So then, what is the bigger victory: the 350R beating an out-of-production Z/28 by 2 tenths in the quarter, or an Alpha SS beating a 5.0 by 7 tenths? The reason I ask is because regardless of what many folks here and other places say about these two cars, there are always some preposterous fatheads who don't want to admit that GM has all the cards. Maybe they really hate GM that bad, or maybe they don't want to admit that their brand of choice isn't that ambitious in this segment anymore. Either way, it's not a good look for them, or their brand.

Presumably AM General is at least familiar with GM processes. And if they're working as hired guns they can probably get up and running pretty quickly. What a wonderful problem for GM to have in the truck segment.

And it doesn't matter... the Camaro5 is done. Even if the video was produced back in September, the Camaro5 had at most 2 months of production left to it. GM was just using up parts at that point. It was an outgoing design on a platform that began development in 1999 and using a 10 year old engine. All of this howling over the "fantastic" flat-plane V8... and for what? 2/10ths of a second to 60 and 1.16 second in a single lap? That is well within the range of driver error in a single lap. 2015-11-28.png Why don't you understand that it is actually a problem that the Mustang just barely beat a car with that kind of age disadvantage? I expect a brand new Ford Mustang GT350R to positively wipe the floor with a 6 year old Camaro chassis that is using a 10 year old engine and last gen Corvette shocks. It didn't..... and that is a problem for the Mustang. I'm not trying to say that the Camaro5 is better... I'm saying I expected a lot more results from the GT350R A) It does matter. The Camaro was not out of production. B) Driver error. Fine. Now the Z/28 is 2+ seconds behind on that specific lap. C) When has any Corvette come with Dynamic Suspension Spool Valve (DSSV) damper system? According to Cammisa, it was a " clear and easy victory ". Im not sure how that equates to barely in your books. If this is the type of victory you're content to hang your hat on then I guess you're just not that picky about what you like. I, on the other hand, will be straight-up mad if GM doesn't have something that'll gong this thing into oblivion for the next few years right around the corner. Excellence of execution must respond swiftly and decisively. Leave catching up to yesterday to the rest.

I have a suspicion that someone in GM may be thinking along similar lines. Just a hunch tho

Dood. That comeback was the WORST Look. Enjoy your victory. Accept the reality that it wasn't crushing. Consider the implications behind that. And let the rest of us raise a glass for the old car (still undefeated in some metrics).

Ccap: the Z/28 and Alpha SS were both quicker than the 350R to 60. My personal theory on the LS7 is that GM underrated it. I suspect it's a trend with them.

Silly is when someone tries to claim the car that was always behind was quicker.I'm sorry you don't understand how videos work. Sure is funny watching you obsess over it tho Sure is funny seeing an LS7 burn a Voodoo to 60 too Still trying to sell that the Z/28 was quicker ( in one aspect ) huh? Sure was awesome seeing a Voodoo burn an LS7 on the street, strip and track, all while coming in at an as tested 10k cheaper. Uh... Not to 60 tho Look. The Chevy had a decade-old engine. The Chevy had the five year-old chassis. The fact that you are crowing over Ford's latest and greatest edging out a car that's out of production is... kinda sad really

Silly is when someone tries to claim the car that was always behind was quicker.I'm sorry you don't understand how videos work. Sure is funny watching you obsess over it tho Sure is funny seeing an LS7 burn a Voodoo to 60 too

"Yew haw! Ford just put its brand new V8 in its brand new, already updated chassis and beat an out-of-production Camaro around a road course by 1.4 seconds!!!" Uh... yay

The Camaro came out in 2009 as a 2010 model. I was there. The LS7 came out in 2005 for a 2006 model. Stop with the semantics. Semantics make you look silly.

I did. Video editing, remember? Seriously man. You got schooled. Just take it like a grownup. You're starting to look silly now.

edited you for clarity. Sorry Drew." Victories don't come any clearer than this. The GT350 is the easy winner of this Head2Head ". And the Z/28 is not a 5yrs old car. It came out for model year 2014. Well, it was a clear victory. Two tenths to 60, 1.4 around the road course. Whether or not it was easy?... Well, two tenths...And you're right, the Z/28 is pretty new as a combination. But the frame and engine sure aren't. Bottom line: Ford had better enjoy the win. I suspect it won't last.

You might want to look at that video again. At no point is the Z/28 ahead in the straight line drag. The Shelby, from dead stop, was always ahead. Why so focused on 0-60 anyways? That's not what either cars purpose is. I'll make it simple. The Z/28 lost. It lost at both track and strip, and lost at being the better street car. Well, you were stoked about ALL THE NUMBERS. ...so you were the one focused on 60. Golly

Oh. It appears you don't know about something called video editing. So sorry. But the 350R is slower to 60. For sure. I defer to Drew on the dyno stuff. As he said, questions have been raised.

Indeed. And as I alluded to earlier: if this is a case of GM underrating their stuff, then who's to say they aren't doing it elsewhere? We already know the ATS-V's engine wound up more powerful than expected.

Yup. So, so far from invincible :D

Oh. It appears you never watched the video closely enough. The out-of-production Z/28 beat the 350R to 60 too. Golly :D ...and I'm terribly sorry. But identical weather, same time and location, identical dyno?... Well... golly again