balthazar

^ looks dumpy, whatever segment that's supposed to be in.

^ There's 275 million IC vehicles in the U.S. - you and I will never see them 'pushed out of the used market'.

No; hence the term "maybe".

If you are speaking to 'ownership' of vehicle pricing; dealers do - vehicles routinely sell for under MSRP. If some day all franchised dealers went away and OEMs had to handle all sales & servicing directly, that's over.

Is the same 'bullshit greed' when VW takes a circa $3 million Bugatti & upcharges it to $13 million? Did they add $10 million worth of anything to the same car? It's got the same engine... Do we 'not need the OEM structure' anymore' because the Bugatti brand did this... or is this a bunch fluff over basically nothing. - - - - - If folk are willing to pay for it, they will. It's on the OEM to determine if they can make their balance sheet work doing so on any sort of scale. It's the same scenario for the dealer, who buys inventory on borrowed capital & incurs carrying costs for vehicles month-by-month as they sit; what will be their bottom line? This is how dealers selling the same product (a Ford Bronco) can sell (or try to) ones at $100K... and at $2K below MSRP.

100% agreed- that's shit business. A deal is a deal. However, your last statement is a whitewashed generalization; no one is saying 'we need a dealer that'll try to add on 5 grand after paperwork is signed'. Because that's certainly not a common practice whatsoever.

Actually, IC engines/transmissions need to be at operating temperature for maximum performance. It's the incoming AIR that benefits from being as cool as possible. - - - - - I don't get a IC car 'cooling down for an hour' before it's first run. 'Cooling down' from what?

Look; asking $100K for a Bronco is flat ridiculous. And it’s not going to sell at $100K, or even $75K. But if someone came in my (fictional) dealership and offered me -say- $60K on a 40-something Bronco, sure as hell I’m taking their money. It’s the buyer’s choice.

It wasn't between rounds, it was before the first round.

I'm not saying the market is determining a $100K tag, I'm saying the market will determine if a $100K tag is viable. That's exactly what was at work when the Vette's tag was cut $21K. No dealer can force anyone to pay 'adjusted' pricing. OEMs do the very same thing with 'launch editions' that cost $5K or $10K more for the same vehicle. There, the market generally says that practice is viable, because those sell (and commonly; sell out). I'm only speaking my mind; personally I'd never pay a 'market adjustment' but then again, I never buy first-year vehicles anyway.

I believe that the legal standpoint is; the vehicle is 'new' if it was never titled. - - - - - I have zero issue with a dealer asking whatever they want for a vehicle. The market will decide if 'it' wants to pay that number.

It's not only launch control. BE's need X-amount of time to cool the batteries first. There was a vid out I think last year; 4 vehicles racing, the top 2 were a Model S and a Lambo Urus. Took the Model S the better part of an HOUR to cool the batteries and keep topping off it's charge in order to maximize its performance. I have no idea what difference it would've made, performance-wise, if they took off in half a minute instead. None of the breathless press releases ever bother to mention that. HummerEV 0-60 is actually 31 seconds.

But they don't. And they can target/benchmark in the full-size truck segment all they want; they're still just cheap copies of the class leaders. Right?

If you’re street racing an EV in an IC, you don’t need launch control: the EV is spotting you a half minute head start.

It’s not a ‘world of $75K’ trucks- the middle 50% is in the $50K’s. toyoter apparently is STILL sitting on their hands RE this upcoming tundra. Hey; 100-120K units may be what they want to sell in the hottest segment going. That’s fine.

Watching a Hummer EV vidoe [here: https://insideevs.com/news/537016/gmc-hummer-ev-wtf-scary/?fbclid=IwAR3HzEhhmfFbxiSHuaBZkw2v1ZeEeukzDKet93hB5vHaS11IoEBGAfy7-_k ] and while everyone ballyhoos how it's going to go 0-60 in about 3 secs, but........ .....no one talks about the TWENTY-EIGHT SECONDS it takes to get ready to utilize the WTF mode.

lexuses are just 'rebadged' cheap cars. Right? Uhhh... just look at the respective model lines.

It's a cheap, baseline brand. It can't carry a $75K plus vehicle.

? How many people are replacing a $24K vehicle with a $75K vehicle??? Not a significant volume, without a doubt.

https://autos.yahoo.com/hyundai-recalls-nearly-100-000-142600625.html