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I don't think that is what he is saying at all. Look at the SUV market that market is declining but all companies are still spending development dollars making new ones and making improvements on the current ones. But they are spending less than they would if it were an emerging market. The same thing will happen with V8s. Less $ being spent on improvements and development but they aren't going to disappear overnight. Those dollars that aren't being spent on V8s are being spent on V6s. I mean really guys do you think the general of old would be spending Mucho $$$ getting its 3.6 DOHC engine into as many cars as it is planning? Or did you think that the OHV V6s and OHV V8s would cover that?

Perhaps the writing is on the walls, and maybe GM knows it recall the dropping of the V8 option on the Lambdas and a possible 300 hp V6 mid model vs a 300 hp V8. My question is will the V8s status remain the same but the game change? My question pertains to GM's XV8 concept from a few years ago. A 4.3L OHV dual cam in block VVT engine that was said to have better packaging AND fuel economy than V6s at the time. Will V8s become smaller in displacement but higher efficiency in order to remain relevent options? http://www.acarplace.com/brands/gm/xv8-engine.html for refrence the XV8 concept.

You know I think I am in that group. Points to consider: I was born in 1981 and as I grew up the only exciting Pontiac was the Firebird, the Fiero was neat but not something that could be considered practical. GP was a rebadged Buick TType without the special engine, 6000 wasn't on my radar at all, GP when it went FWD was cool looking but not as cool as the Z34 Lumina. I never really considered a Pontiac as a car for myself until just recently when I began to consider the last Grand Am and even then the outside styling was up to par but the interior and powertrain/chassis just aren't what I would like from them.I also agree with evok that time is not on Pontiac's side. From what we have heard the only thing that Pontiac has on the drawing board is the next G6 and a slightly refreshed W-body GP(very short lived). Then what Pontiac will have Vibe, Solstice, G5, G6, GP. A GTO may or may not be out before 2010 but even then you have a VERY small lineup and I don't think GM has a proper plan to keep Pontiac going while this new RWD structure is developed, unless it plans on basing everything off of Zeta, which would be to large for a compact car.

I think it should subliminally say "Toyota Sucks, GM rocks" through the radio.

Wow all of that GM is going bankrupt retoric was pretty off then wasn't it.

They fit within the 6 speed auto's case and that means they fit just fine in the 4 speed's place. Just need to find a hiding spot for the batteries.

Look at the TB SS and you will see what they are, brake cooling ducts.

That sounds really Awesome 68!

I did it on an LQ1, that is right I had to take off the FREAKING upper intake manifold. Who thinks of crap like that anyways?Wanted to add the new 3.5 Duratec V6 has to do the exact same thing.

A 305 would be a 5.0L. I think they are going bigger, maybe 5.5 L. It seems Round metric numbers are the new cubic inches.

You said LS4 which is FWD only. There are 3 or more RWD 5.3s the non DOD one found in the GMT360 regulars, GMT800 Tahoe, and GMT800 Silverado. The 5.3 DOD found in the GMT360 EXTs. And the new 5.3 DOD 320ish hp one in the GMT900s.But it doesn't matter since all these 5.3s will likely be replaced before the Camaro comes out.

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Please read post #19, where I explain logically why the 3.6 HF will be used.Also the LS4 is FWD only, and 5.3 liters will likely not be the small displacement Gen IV size for much longer. Same with the 6.0 it will be replaced by the 6.2 or 6.3 L LS3.

What if it had gotten the 4.0 N* from Olds? How does that sound?

Yep.

Yeah I noticed that too and even the Mazdaspeed6 still uses the bar, body colored now. Lets be real guys Mazda used it first.

griff anyword if GM is working on a way to turn its FWD 6 speed autos into fwd 6 speed manuals, like they might be doing to the RWD ones?

I knew you would come into this thread you seem to like 'different' cars and technologies. Are there any modern flat engines besides Porches and Subbies? As far as length of an I4 vs a boxer I would imagine the boxer is shorter because the cylinders can overlap a little because they are on opposite sides of the crankshaft. The engine would be wider but not wider than a transversly mounted engine.

The bump in the hood makes me think V8.

Hmm...So lots in the past but very few now.

My tubes ran with the cylinders and rotated around the bore centers not longitudinally, which I had seen done. My idea for variable opening area revolved around a 2 piece design for the cylinder that would rotate on each other making the opening bigger or smaller (narrower or wider) based upon need. I was thinking hydraulic control would be used as opposed to gears to quiet it down.

I thought subbies was vertical pistons that were split making it a || || || || design and that the crank case was all weird about it. Am I wrong?Edit: Just looked it up and I'll be damned it is a true flat 4. Kinda cool is that the only one of its kind out there?

I have never owned or ridden in a flat engined vehicle but have found myself very intrigued recently by them, both the Porche flat 6s, Corvair flat 6's, and also the Subaru 3.0 and 3.3 flat 6's. Has anyone ever made a flat 4, a flat 6 with 2 cylinders chopped off? Would this design not be as or more stable than an I4 or a boxer 4 (like the Subaru 4's)? What about flat 8s, they sound like they would be very well balanced and be as low as flat 6's and they would have more area of combustion? Would not a flat 4/6/8 engine architecture be the most cost/engineering effective series of engines to build and package? Why aren't/haven't there been more out of the V (play on out of the box, I know it is not funny my bad) engine designs and if so what were they? I know of the Wankel rotor and the Miller cycle derivitives of Otto cycle engines. Just looking to expand my knowledge of cars a little bit. If it amuses you to answer or discuss feel free if not then let it slide. Thanks for listening to my rambles.

That was D*MN funny.

Ultra or N* varient?