Camino LS6

The truth, of course, lies somewhere in the middle. Unfair Japanese business practices were and are a major factor. The unions stepped over the line of just and reasonable demands decades ago. Our own government has left its head rotting in the sand for decades. GM management made deals it knew it could not honor indefinitely. So on and so forth. What we are left with now is reality's ugly face holding tomorrow behind its back and out of reach without honest cooperation between the old foes.

Of course GM needs the "better Camry", and a more flexible small RWD platform (which they are working on) but they went the extra mile and brought us Kappa much earlier than would have been possible via the development of the more flexible platform. They brought it to us using parts bin items and built it in an otherwise idle plant with a budget that wouldn't scratch the surface of the larger program. In doing so, they pave the way to this new platform with the public good will established by these pioneer roadsters. If they make a few bucks on Kappa when the production run ends, great. IF it costs them a few bucks after all is said and done, then it is money well spent establishing a more favorable reception for the new architecture when it arrives. This sort of product is what is needed in all segments, on that I think we can agree.

I dismiss him in a slightly more civil manner than he dismisses me. I am unconvinced of the value of his input. I believe that his pronouncements (always presented as incontovertible fact) are often premature at best. This has nothing to do with ego, I want what is good for C&G and GM. This requires that a free exchange of ideas be possible in an environment of respect. Something that his posts are devoid of. I posit that had the course of action your cadre seem to back been followed we wouldn't have any new product in the small RWD segment at all. Further, when the "volume" model finally debuted without the support of the roadsters, no one would even notice and the mediocrity at GM would continue. Building a better Camry just won't cut it, GM needs models that set it apart from the crowd. Do we need the volume product you are calling for? Of course we do, but we need the goodwill of the public more. I enjoy constructive debate and the presentation of opposing ideas, Evok seems to enjoy only unqualified adulation.

No worries, I have edited to poll to reflect the change in your vote from 2 to 0.

As a nation, we are so pathetically late looking into alternative fuels. It is a critical economic and national security issue - or it should be.

Absolutely correct, and beyond the understanding of some.

Really now, must you always resort to insults? Lumping me in with Buickman is uncalled for and about as far off base as possible. Your delusions of granduer and infallibility make any geniune input on your part hardly worth the price. I do think your position absurd and a product of too much time spent in the bloodless company of numbers and self assurance. You continuously present your predictions of the final impact of a product and program that is just now making an impact on the general public. I have attempted again and again to be civil and respectful of you and to move the discussion into a positive place. You, on the other hand seem to thrive on discord and disrespect and drag things down to whatever bitter place your mind occupies. Kappa is good news no matter how you try to spin it to the negative. I have never seen someone try so hard to be a minus player at C&G. You really think much too highly of yourself. and, more importantly, too little of others. Any news that's positive you will ignore or spin to the downside, and you make exactly zero attempt to understand the opinions,impressions or positions of anyone who refuses to accept your opinion as the word of God. If anyone is as oversure of himself as Buickman, you get the nod.

Creative, I'm glad you have taken such an even tone and made measured responses to the onslaught we subjected you to. I wish I had some information to help you out, I would happily post it. And if you can make the Avalon interesting, well, that is something I'd have to see. Good luck in your endeavors and I hope you won't hold the presence of the occasional "Lance" against us.

Doesn't matter, it was still your first car.

I honestly have no idea what you mean by this post. Certainly, we've established that our viewpoints on this topic differ greatly. We find one another's positions absurd. I was just expressing my opinion in shorthand.

According to my mother, when I was very little I would cry when a car got smashed on TV. I guess my obsession started early.

I never thought about how the Harry thing would look to anyone who didn't know. Must have seemed mighty strange.

Right now I'm imagining the garage containing all of the sick beasts we have proposed in this thread. Wow, what a sight!

Actually,GM has built FWD cars with longitudinal V8s. I even owned one once. :AH-HA_wink:

I remember reading this over at CZ28 a while back. With the tidbits that have been glimpsed since then I think he saw the CTS and a Holden/GTO/generic zeta coupe mule. There are VE cars running all over Australia at this point, so we can rest assured that a few mules ahve made their way here. Definitely related to Camaro but not a Camaro mule would be my guess. One other possibility for the sedan is the alleged zeta DTS.

*sigh* V. 2.0

The Picture thread. My chest hurts from all the insane laughter and my dog thinks I've lost it.

As long as there's tire smoke in your sig, you're not old!

Ummm, this is a BAD idea. Trust me on this.

*sigh*

Yikes!

Sounds like a cool program, if I had the cash lying around I'd go buy one and hit the track.

1987 El CaminoSS 1990 K3500 Silverado 454,4spd. 2001 2500 HD Silverado extd. 4x4 2002 Firehawk 2004 GTO 2005 2500HD Silverado Duramax/Allison

Not cars that your family has purchased, but you yourself. List them if you like.

On the GP: price seems kinda stiff for a 9-10 year-old car. The power windows are probably not a cheap fix(although a common problem).